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| Antler restrictions in Va. http://vaturkey.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4320 |
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| Author: | Econo [ Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Antler restrictions in Va. |
Whats everybody think about having antler resitrictions in va. I am 4 it. I think it would improve the quallity of our bucks. We still have to many hunters shooting small bucks. I would say to start maybe go with at least 3 points on 1 side. See how it goes, then change as needed. Dont want to start a battle here, just like to see how everyone else feels on this matter. |
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| Author: | Neill [ Sun Dec 14, 2008 11:03 am ] |
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I'm completely against it. I don't think the state should be in the business of regulating trophies or determining who shoots what beyond beyond biological bases. Besides it's been proven over and again that antler restrictions are not effective because they cause high grading of young bucks with potential while mature bucks of poor antler quality fail to mee the restriction. I pass young bucks and encourage others who have shot their share to do so as well. But I think the trophy mentality that seeks to make harvest decisions for others, deer hunting generally more restrictive, is the wrong direction for the future of the sport. |
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| Author: | ClarkeCoHntr [ Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:30 pm ] |
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I stopped shooting small bucks 6 years ago and have only killed one buck since then, a 140 inch. I know half of the "small" 8 points and little scrub bucks I pass up get shot when they cross the property line. Its frustrating to try and manage a property when you know adjacent properties don't have the same standards I do. However, the trophy is in the eye of the beholder, so if that small 8 point I pass up is a trophy for another adult or child, power to them. Lord knows I used every buck tag in my wallet on 4 and 6 points my first 5 years hunting. I think the state would be hurting a lot of people who don't have the properties or time some of us do to devote to hunting if they regulate antlers. The person who hunts 5 acres of woods or only gets to hunt twice a year may only see a 4 point, and that deer could be the highlight of their season. |
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| Author: | turkey342 [ Sun Dec 14, 2008 3:34 pm ] |
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I mostly agree with Neill on this it should be up the the person hunting.What if you can only get to hunt one or two days a year and only see a small buck. |
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| Author: | Gobblevt [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 9:15 am ] |
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I personally agree with Todd on this one because I only shoot does for meat and bucks that I'm gonna spend $ to get mounted...so they gotta be big! With that said, for the greater good and for first time hunters, it should be left open....I think they (Va game comm), should spend more time on regulating the seasons than the size restriction on bucks. I have a farm in Fauquier Co..This year they extended the antlerless season until March in Fauquier and several NOVA counties.........How many big bucks that have lost their antlers will be shot???? In our county, some parts have lots of deer and some do not, but the extended season is county wide. Does not make any sense....The dumbest thing VDGIF has done in years! Hopefully they will reconsider after stats are recorded this year............Look at all the states that repeatedly produce big bucks in the mid-west.....Illinois, Kansas, Iowa, Nebraska.......and look at their buck seasons.....shorter and more managed between gun, archery, and BP seasons......most don't have a general firearms season during the rut........State management does work.....they just gotta get it right................ |
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| Author: | Bird Dog [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 10:36 am ] |
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I'm with Neill ( good post) . I do however believe that by reducing the buck harvest we can achieve two gains. Encourage more does be taken and saving some bucks to mature thus bringing the herd more in balance and improving quality while still allowing hunters to harvest deer. I would be in favor of a 2 buck limit per year. Hunters will naturally be a little more selective on the second buck especially after a couple years. |
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| Author: | mudfork [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:15 pm ] |
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I am in favor of antler restrictions. This opinion comes after 7 years of hunting a county in Georgia where legal bucks must have 4 points on a side. The quality of bucks there has steadily improved, and blew through the roof this year. Hancock County Georgia has 2 1/2 months of either sex rifle season and there are fantastic bucks and many does. Most informed hunters when given the above constraints make good deer harvest choices. However, AR's must come with an better doe strategy than the VDGIF has. For example, let's just say my home county of Tazewell had AR's. I take a weeks vacation with a doe day hanging at the end on Saturday. I see several does and small bucks all week, then Saturday rolls around and 30 MPH winds and rains hit. No deer for me on vacation. The answer I propose is a one doe tag on our license that can be punched at anytime, opening day, last day, or any day between. Even without AR's, more bucks would be passed if we had an "anytime doe tag". That way folks don't have to drop the first small buck they see in order not to end the season deerless. Being deerless at the end of the season is a fear that scares most hunters to death. I have done alot of hunting in Bedford County, and I'm convinced one of the major reasons it is a big buck hotspot is that hunters there don't hit the woods in "panic mode" as far as bringing venison home. |
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| Author: | Max [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:21 pm ] |
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There are always sub groups within any larger group. It is no different with deer hunters. We all need to remember that as a group we should do what is BEST for the sport not us as an individual. The right to hunt is the target of many ignorant and self righteous people who love to see hunter fight and fuss among ourselves. ALWAYS bare that in mind. Now as far as Deer management in VA. I can not speak for the entire state but I can make points based on what I observe in my neck of the woods in Augusta, Rockingham, Higland, and Rockbridge Counties. 1) In Western VA the Early ML season is now too long. More Illegal bucks are being taken than ever before (West has one buck per hunter limit in early ML) 2) In the west I would like to see a antlerless only week long season. 3) Again in the West the limit of 2 either sex deer tags should be cut to 1 at least for a 2 year trial period. I know I will get disagreement to this BUT hear me out. I have been blessed to hunt in some pretty fine deer woods across the country. The best hunting , with the best quality of deer are ALWAYS in areas that only allow 1 buck per season. Think about it, this allows the guy who doesn't get much time to hunt or wants to take the first buck her sees to do so. Those that wishing to wait on something better can do so without the wondering of what will happen if I let this buck walk scenario running in their head. I do not hunt in the east of the state so I don't really have a good picture as to what needs done there if anything. |
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| Author: | mudfork [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:31 pm ] |
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Max, I very much agree with #1. As far as #3, maybe at least make the second buck have 4 points on a side, but the one buck limit would be fine. |
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| Author: | ClarkeCoHntr [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 1:01 pm ] |
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They need to give us more doe tags on the regular license. I am already on my second set of bonus tags and 18.00 for two does is steep. Make it easier and cheaper for us to manage the doe population to start with which will make the herd healthier. Also, what about making one of the two regular either sex tags archery only? That would cut out one small buck for all the people who only gun hunt and shoot whatever horns they see (I feel like there are a lot of people who do this). Also, if people wanted to use that archery tag, they would have incentive to be hunting earlier in the season and probably take more does as well. The problem with the archery tag would be the same with the muzzleloader possibly though, they could shoot it with a gun and check it as archery. That leads me to the issue of the call in system which I hate...talk about making it easy for people to cheat! |
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| Author: | jp [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 3:57 pm ] |
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Econo, this is a loaded question in the east with hound hunting. Remember, there are 2 sets of rules in VA. East and west rules. I hunt both and won't go into any discussion cause of the posts that will begin to come in. Personally, I think antler restrictions would not be in thebest interest of our sport and too hard to enforce. |
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| Author: | WVBOY [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:33 pm ] |
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I think it should be a one buck limit down from three.. I know plenty of guys up here that tell me "Yea I killed a spike or fork horn just to get a buck on the ground, now I might get picky and wait on a bigger one" That is stupid, if you are going to pass on them why not pass on them from the get go, and not after you kill the first one. I eat tag soup quite often on my buck tags, because I won't shoot anything that is not past the ears. I will probably eat it again this year too, although it is my own fault, because I missed two bucks that met my criteria. If it were a one buck limit then the guys who shoot a spike of forky young buck might think twice before they burn that tag, but for the guys who don't care and just get out a few times a year and will glady take a spike or forky young buck it will work for them too. |
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| Author: | TK582 [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:35 pm ] |
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I have been watching this post for the day and I wanted to read a bunch of them before I posted my two cents. From growing up in Western New York where a spike with 6 inch spikes was a "Good Buck" and killing a doe want 100% prohibited in my camp but that was the norm around the region. The theory was if you kill the does who will have the babies. As we all know now that is not the truth. It took me until I was 18 to shoot my first deer. It was a doe and I was actually afraid to hear what the guys in my camp had to say about it. Needless to say I did not care. I started hunting PA. before the antler restriction (3 points on one side in the county I hunt) and again a 6 inch spike was a dandy. I believe in 2001 (ish) they started the restriction on points per side depending on what county you were in. From the first year I have shot nice bucks and so has everyone in my group. They are not no "Booners" but they are what I think are respectable deer. I know I have 2 of them on the wall. I am in favor of the restrictions. I like the idea. I get anxious when I have a buck infront of me. I have not killed 50 bucks I bet I am in the range of 15 or so but I still get excited when I have a spike in front of me. It does not mean that I have to shoot it. I do believe that the deer season is entirly too long in VA. I do also agree with WVBOY that three buck tag are way to many. But on the flip side if a person is happy with a spike I do not look down on them either. I have hunted a bit in the midwest over the last 4 years and you only get one buck tag in the "Big Buck States" Iowa, Ill. Ohio and so on. What to these staes have in common.... short gun seasons and one buck per season. That could be the ticket around here and reducing the number of buck tags. I am one of the guys who has a hard time not shooting the first deer that walks by. I enjoy hunting. I am trying. It is much easier once you get the first of the year. The kids love to see deer in the garage. There are a ton of Pro's and Con's to all of these points that we have made here. If we kill more does and try and learn some patience this could be done without the restriction. Just my 2 cents Good Luck the rest of the year, Tom |
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| Author: | Econo [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:54 pm ] |
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Very good points made by all. I guess this is something that comes down to indavidual opinions, and I respect all that has been stated. Several of you mentioned things that I didn't even think about. The reason I posted this is because I was reading all the post on the VDGIF site about antler restrictions, who is for or against. I guess this will be a tuff one for VDGIF to decide on. Thanks for all the input guy's, there is a lot more to think about than what I originally thought. Thanks for keeping the discussion just that a ( Discussion ) Merry Christmas to all of Va. Turkey |
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| Author: | Neill [ Mon Dec 15, 2008 7:19 pm ] |
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Maybe a good compromise would be to impose antler restrictions on some of the state wildlife management areas. That would give an opportunity for trophy management on some public land without forcing it on the rest of the state. |
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